.416 Single Stack AR Round – The Hushpuppy–SHOT Show 2015

in Ammo Tests, Authors, Sam Trisler, SHOT Show 2015, Uncategorized

Updated: January 28, 2015 BY Sam Trisler

Fat, Flat, and Not So Fast. Meet the Hushpuppy! The fat part is right. And it is rumored to shoot very flat. This is a subsonic round and a big one at that. The .416 Hushpuppy is currently in development by AM-TAC Precision. So what is this cute sounding cartridge and why should you know about it? Well, first off it will work in an AR-15 style rifle (with some obvious modifications). It fits in standard AR magazines, but single stacked. It uses a 7.62×39 bolt on a standard carrier group. AM-TAC will be selling barrels, complete uppers and rifles in the coming months.

Ok. It works in an AR, but what about the important stuff? From what we have seen and read, it looks like a great subsonic 200 yard cartridge. This would make a heck of a good hog hunting round. The bullet is designed to tumble on impact to create a larger wound channel. Look at the deformed bullet pics below. This thing doesn’t mushroom. Instead, the wound channel is cut in by the massive projectile as it tumbles.

Check out the pictures below for some charts and graphs AM-TAC supplied for more information.

The projected cost of a complete upper at this time is around $1,000. Complete rounds will be around $2.50 each but they promise to sell brass and supply data. No word on dies though. Could this round give .300 Blackout a run for its money?

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Info from AM-TAC

Info from AM-TAC

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Cross Sectional

Cross Sectional

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dsfds

Kinetic.

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dsf

Momentum.

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Single stacked a standard AR mag will hold 10 rounds of .416 Hushpuppy.

Single stacked a standard AR mag will hold 10 rounds of .416 Hushpuppy.

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Big bullets.

Big bullets.

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This one punched through a bunch of hay bales and smacked a concrete wall.

This one punched through a bunch of hay bales and smacked a concrete wall.

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Next to a .30 Caliber bullet.

Next to a .30 Caliber bullet.

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It will work out of a .45 suppressor.

It will work out of a .45 suppressor.

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Another view of the flattened round.

Another view of the flattened round.

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Tizwicky2009 January 31, 2015, 5:04 pm

I’m a little more than skepital in fact I have deep doubts and reservations. I can’t imagine that the small case has enough volume to hold enough powder to propel a 450gr projectile at any useful velocity!

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SSgt_Mas January 31, 2015, 9:07 am

Dumb dumb dumb. Showing a projectile that smacked a concrete wall to imply that expansion is possible with this round is dishonest.

Claiming it will be “flat” to 200 yards, heavy AND subsonic is insulting the intelligence of your readers. Flat to 200 yards on the MOON maybe.

Using a suppressor with this round? Ever heard of a baffle strike- let us know how that works out for you.

This round fills no niche or market demmand, and will end up in the parts bin of cartidge history.

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What I know January 31, 2015, 2:19 am

I like $2.50 a round, that’s a cheap price for ammo.

You all sound like a bunch of whinny, pissy teenagers.

My 416 rem cost me at least $5.00 a shot to reload.

Depending on the type bullets I us to reload my 416 rem like
BARNS or WOODLEIGH bullets, it can cost up $20.00 to load.

My 416 rem very easily gets up to $20.00 a shot, and more for factory ammo.

My 45-120 Sharps cost at least $10.00 a shot.

My 45-120 Sharps very easily cost $20.00 a round to shoot.

Cheap 5.56 ammo can cost $1.00 easily.

Good quality .223 ammo can get up $5.00 a round.

My 30-06 is at least $2.50 to $5.00 to reload, depending on
the type of bullets, like Barnes TSX.

Good quality 30-06 factory ammo can cost $5.00 to $10.00 a round.

When you start using 90 to 120 grains of powder to load a
DANGEROUS GAME BELTED MAGNUM CARTAGE, then
tell me about ammo cost.

Thank You.

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Five-O January 30, 2015, 1:05 pm

I have had my 5.56 for 5 years and my 300 blkout since early December 2014. To have the two guns with fully interchangeable parts, except the barrel, is great. If I am out plinking or hunting and a pin, spring or some other random malfunction happens, hasn’t yet, I can make the needed swap out and save the trip with out needing a tool bench. Plus my 300 blkout hosts a caliber specific EOTECH that gives me a 65MOA circle with two 1MOA dots. The top dot gives me 50yrds subsonic and 150yrds supersonic. The bottom dot gives me 150yrds subsonic and 300yrds supersonic. This is all out of a 10.5″ AR15 pistol platform. I am using Hornady 110gr for super and 208gr for sub. This means I have one caliber for wooded areas and one for open areas with the same optics platform. Why would I need a new system? I have spent years planning, saving, building what makes sense. I know I am not alone! So it is bigger. So it tumbled. This season I plan on putting meat in the freezer as provision for my family, Lord willing!!! The hush puppy simply will never have a home in my safe!!!

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Steve January 30, 2015, 1:03 pm

This is an answer looking for a question. I’d go with the .308. Longer effective range, less expensive, available over the counter and a proven hog killer. JMHO

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Duke January 30, 2015, 4:27 am

Cool name….Hushpuppy.

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Bill January 29, 2015, 6:05 pm

It sure is obvious they don’t want to compare apples to apples when comparing to the 458 Socom. Try putting it up against the Barnes Tac-Tx or TTSX 300 gr or even another comparable 400 gr bullet to make the comparison accurate.

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Kyle January 29, 2015, 5:41 pm

I really hope none wasted the money to get this through SAMMI. As much as I think 300blk is niche, this is even worse. Seriously who thought this would corner any market? Why not just use a 45acp, 300blk, 7.62×39, 30-30, ect.? All of these are already cheap(ish) compared to what this is going to start at. I get for what ever role this was specifically designed for, it probably does a good job at it but why when theres already acceptable options on the table. And
They are all much more available then this will ever be, who’s brilliant idea was this, really?

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djw663 January 29, 2015, 5:08 pm

The negative is obvious $2.50 per pull, ouch. The pluses are nice: power, power and more power coupled with standard parts that are inexpensive and easily attainable. How many gun enthusiasts don’t have an AR? How many don’t have an AK? How many don’t have a .45? We will need to see why they needed to create such a round and whom is asking for it? I don’t think a company would be stupid enough to create something new and specialty with all the information all of you provided in this forum unless there was a specific need?

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- Bill Talaber January 30, 2015, 12:47 am
  
  Glock, in their infinite wisdom, brought out the .45 GAP. Try to improve on the .45 ACP??? See how that one went? In a pinch, you don’t walk into a Walmart or for that matter, many gun shops, and buy .45 GAP ammo. If the S.H.T.F., I want something I can take off an “enemy” and use for ammo. Just my point of view!
  
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  - djw663 January 30, 2015, 4:20 pm
    
    That is why I wanted to know what prompted the development of this round. I too want very common rounds that I can buy or pick up anywhere.
    Using other ammo was one of the bummers for our 5.56 because we could not shoot 7.62 in our guns but my dad remembers, in Vietnam, others being able to shoot our ammo in theirs it just was not very accurate but a broken clock is right twice a day.
    
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Duane January 29, 2015, 1:57 pm

At $2.50 a round, this never going to become more popular that a 300 ACC at .85 a round and falling.

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Dan M January 29, 2015, 12:37 pm

So, all of those dangerous high capacity clip magazine thingies that I and my good democrat friends banned based upon the sound governing principle of emotion after the actions of just one individual in Newtown CT are NO LONGER high capacity? If those dangerous high capacity clip magazine thingies will only hold 10 of those big bullets, I won’t have to hide all of mine anymore because the line was too long for me to “register” them that day. Whew! I was wondering how I was going to sneak them by my security detail without my “declaration” form and only loaded with 10 bullets. I LOVE AMERICA!!!!

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- djw663 January 29, 2015, 5:10 pm
  
  My sentiments exactly!
  
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  - SSgt_Mas January 31, 2015, 9:25 am
    
    Welcome to the party- ever heard of the .458 SOCOM? Only ten rounds fit in a 30-rd GI mag, and it’s infinitely more popular than this hushpuppy turd will ever be. Do some research first guys, and don’t be so desperate to find an answer in search of a problem.
    
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Rick Barnett January 29, 2015, 12:17 pm

We’re Americans right?? I’m sure most of us have served our country and been deployed to fucked up areas and some of us have even had fuckers try to kill us. We did all that so we could have every choice possible. Does a family of three need a 5000 square foot house? Do I need a car with a little over 500 horsepower to the wheels? Do I need a gun safe that looks like the National Armory?? No. I have a lot of shit that is impractical, un-needed, and plain dumb on the face of it…but I’m not buying..driving..or being seen in a Prius…and I’m not buying just one gun and saying enough is enough. Who cares if it tumbles..or what flat is..or the cost of it…its big..it goes boom..it makes big holes..IT’S FOR ME.

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- Mr Brett January 29, 2015, 11:13 pm
  
  I totally get what you’re saying. I usually just comment on the pistols, whenever something new comes out you get to read about how so and so is going to stick with his Glock, 1911, Smith & Wesson, etc,. Recently a Glock owner (I own a few myself) was trashing a new CZ pistol because it was plastic and had plastic magazines…
  
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  - SSgt_Mas January 31, 2015, 9:21 am
    
    I trashed the latest junk CZ Skorpion pistol because that’s what you do to garbage. You cannot compare a fully metal-lined polymer mag with metal feed lips like Glock makes to an ALL polymer mag with corresponding polymer feedlips.
    
    I’m not going to attempt explaining this again- you either learn from the buying mistakes of others, or play stubborn and waste your own money on junk toys that don’t last.
    
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    - Rick January 31, 2015, 12:46 pm
      
      Gee Sarge…you totally missed the frigging point..but thanks for your financially fiscal logic filled reply.
      
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- SSgt_Mas January 31, 2015, 9:14 am
  
  Using that logic, we vets should just buy every stupid new caliber until our gun safes are full of useless shit. Or, we could have more sense than money and actually adhere to a strategy of buying fun items that are durable, useful, and will hold their value. Do your research before you buy- don’t make impulse purchases that you’ll regret later- unless you’re swimming in a big pool of money like Scrooge McDuck.
  
  Nobody wants to be the guy with more money than sense- the guy who blows his entire check by the 2nd and 16th of every month- I served with lots of financially irresponsible guys like that. Some $1000 wasr ak’s and $900 remington 1911’s come to mind…
  
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James January 29, 2015, 11:52 am

No thanks, I am going to stick to my .458 SOCOM. Already proven it’s self and I don’t see any advantages to the Hushpuppy. Am I missing something?

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- Keith Waters January 30, 2015, 10:17 am
  
  The .50 Beowulf being a better round-just a fact. I have tried both and went with great rifle and designer(.50B). .458aside why..is the question? Which has been answered(????)
  Now the Chey Tac is another thing entirely….their .416 is a Beast…
  
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Carl January 29, 2015, 11:37 am

Another unnecessary round that they keep making to generate sales. Personally I think the “Tactical” genre is just a sales gimmick that a whole bunch of wannabe’s buy so they can be the “coolest” on the block. So many think they can be so great in a fire fight or a shoot out. Doubtful. Personally I surely didn’t like either. . And what’s with Tactical Shotguns?? I kinda think any shotgun racked in the middle of the night is sure tactical enough for me.,,,well if I was the BG. That said.. I have a 300 Whisper I like ARs and I really like suppressed guns and full auto….but most of this tactical stuff is truly unnecessary …and as I said…. a way to separate the buyer from his money. I said this knowing I’ll probably get slammed by the cool dudes but facts are still facts

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Phil January 29, 2015, 10:51 am

I’m going to pass on using a bullet for game hunting that is designed to tumble. Strange. Would be a fun gun to target shoot suppressed, since it’s subsonic. I am partial to the larger calibers. But, flat out to 200 yards? That seems like a stretch, depending on your definition of “flat”.

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- Sam January 29, 2015, 6:50 pm
  
  correct me if i’m wrong but doesn’t the 223 tumble?
  
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  - Mr Brett January 29, 2015, 10:57 pm
    
    In general 5.56 tumbles, some .223 will but some is designed to expand too.
    
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- SigManDan January 31, 2015, 1:21 pm
  
  Notice the article mentions that it is flat out to 200 yards on a MAN SIZED target? How many game animals have a kill zone the size/length of the human torso? Just a thought…
  
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Erich January 29, 2015, 10:32 am

Looks like it will be good for all those cartridge collectors to stick in a display case.

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mattitiude January 29, 2015, 10:03 am

Does this projectile defy gravity or something? How can a subsonic round shoot flat out to 200 yards?

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- Mike January 29, 2015, 6:55 pm
  
  The CheyTac round has phenomenal Bullet Coefficient numbers, so perhaps this one shared that stability even though it only has a comparatively small puff of powder pushing it along.
  
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Rob62 January 29, 2015, 9:38 am

“The projected cost of a complete upper at this time is around $1,000. Complete rounds will be around $2.50 each”

Good Grief – at those prices NO THANKS. Even as more of this ammo and accs. come to market and prices go down, if you are a reloader why bother ?! You can get the 7.62×39 and 7.62 NATO cartridges down to sub sonic very easily.
Defiantly not for me. But then I was really wrong about the .357 SIG cartridge, so who knows. This may turn out to be the best thing since sliced bread.

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Fred January 29, 2015, 8:48 am

They announced this at SHOT last year and still nothing for sale exactly one year later. Any videos of this round being discharged from a weapon, yet? “Vaporware” comes to mind…

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Michael W. January 29, 2015, 8:09 am

In my opinion I believe the .50 Beowulf is a far more versatile and effective round. Load 500 to 600 grain rounds for subsonic use. They mushroom and devastate. Would love to hear other opinions on the subject.

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- Tom January 29, 2015, 1:11 pm
  
  I agree, why go half way when the .50 Beowulf is a proven round. 300 AAC is for the guy that wants an AR10, but has an AR15. 50 Beowulf is for the guy that wants an 82A1, but doesn’t have 10k & need 1 mile accuracy.
  
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Jay January 29, 2015, 7:26 am

Looks like an interesting newbie to consider for some. I however would want to see real world results with this round in the hunting field before jumping on any band wagon like so many do these days. Any of us that have hunted wild hog can attest that those buggers can be tough at times if shot placement isn’t where you intended and they run pretty dang fast! Fist thing I noticed was their reference to “knock-down Power” someone needs to get their head out the hollywood phrases, there is no such thing and that word is a misnomer unless the bullet weight is close to the thing your shooting but then again the recoil would knock you down too, not good! I can guarantee your truck has the ability of knock down power to a deer, cow etc… but no firearm. The term stopping power or kinetic energy would be the words to consider! At their projected cost and round cost not a lot of people are going to go for this one, too expensive for most. Then again you have to consider the fact that no caliber is good and or bad all the time, bullet placement will always remain king of the intended target stop!

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Dan January 29, 2015, 6:50 am

How does this compare to readily available (and less expensive) .308’s?

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- Larry Mondello January 29, 2015, 7:07 am
  
  Why bother, when an AR10 is available and perfected??
  
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  - oldtimered January 29, 2015, 8:26 pm
    
    True.
    But this round appears to be a subsonic round good to 200 yards and used with a silencer could have great hunting applications as a slow moving heavy bullet which puts its energy where it is meant to go; into the target. Could be interesting
    
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  - Steve S January 31, 2015, 8:18 am
    
    It will be also usable through the AR15 platform which is smaller and lighter than the AR-10 platform.
    
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- Erock January 29, 2015, 7:20 am
  
  Doesnt,fad round,will be moot in a year.
  
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  - Scotty Gunn January 29, 2015, 9:29 am
    
    Exactly. I’ve grown to like 300 AAC , but even to reload it is expensive.
    $2.50 a round? Not touching this one, it will die on the vine.
    
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    - fenwick's in the manger January 29, 2015, 12:04 pm
      
      $2.50 per round??? More like 34 cents per round. brass $0.00 [free from the last 1000 rounds shot], 3 cents for the primer, 3 cents for the powder [H110, Lil Gun, etc], 28 cents for each projectile.
      
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      - Josh January 29, 2015, 3:48 pm
        
        .34 with the brass being free. First off the first time you use those 1000 cases your going to be out at least $1.00 if its unloaded brass. Second you don’t know how many uses you will get. It looks like the built will be a special one not a already off the shelf built so my gess is the built is going to be .50 to $1.00 a peace. With a factory offering of 2.50 I don’t think this will go any where. You have to think of what gap in what is already available this will fill or what it will do better. At 2.50 around I would rather by a 50 Beowulf that is going to be much harder hitting at longer range. Or just by a shot gun if this is for closer range. If it was some thing like the 6.5 Grendel that had military application it might have a chance, but this I would have to say is not going to go anywhere fast simply because it has no niche.
        
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- shrugger January 29, 2015, 9:29 am
  
  One’s an apple. The other is an orange.
  
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- Terry January 29, 2015, 12:04 pm
  
  SO this will not be usable in CA, or other states, that require expanding bullets for all game. A bit more research on your articles and if things can actually apply to hunting would be great.
  
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